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Eythian
Posting is for Closers
51 Posts |
 Posted - 07/03/2005 : 04:34:22 AM
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Because I'm lazy and was tired of manually adding files, I've decided to automate podcast support in NDBM.
Initially, it'll be pretty primitive. I'm currently adding support for queueing files up so they are added to the device when you next synchronise, and I'll write a podcatcher (probably based on bashpodder, just written in Perl because bash is less good with XML:)) that adds files to the queue.
However, ultimately I'd like it to be at the stage where you can do everything from within NDBM (add feeds, selectively download, whatever) along with an agent that can pull them down daily when NDBM isn't running.
I haven't yet had a reply from the NDBM author to my email about this, so for the time being at least it'll not be part of the main tree.
What I want to know now is: is anyone interested in helping me test this?
What you'll need at this stage is the ability to run Perl on your machine (Linux/Mac users shouldn't have a problem, Windows users will need something like ActivePerl), to listen to podcasts (or want to start), and maybe a little tech savvy as it won't be the most userfriendly thing just yet. The ability to compile java or know what to do with .jar files would be helpful, but not essential (I have no idea how this works on Windows)
It might go a bit slowly as I have a fair amount of Real Work that needs to be done too, but I hope it won't be too bad.
If there is any interest (reply to this post), I'll let you know when I have the queue system working. May even happen tonight if I'm feeling productive. |
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Eythian
Posting is for Closers
51 Posts |
Posted - 07/03/2005 : 10:08:17 AM
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OK, so I was fairly productive after all. I have a version of NDBM that allows files to be queued for addition, and a podcatcher that works with it.
The NDBM plus the podcatcher (which I've named perlpodder, original huh?) is available at:
http://www.kallisti.net.nz/~robin/ndbm_pp.tar.gz
Note that this will probably tell you that there are updates available...don't update or it won't work (it's actually based off the very latest development version, so an update will actually downgrade it)
The source containing my modifications to NDBM are at:
http://www.kallisti.net.nz/~robin/ndbm_src.tar.gz (you won't need this unless you want to see the changes)
If you want to give it a go, view the perlpodder.pl file. You'll possibly want to change some of the settings, which live at the top of the file (if you're on a UNIX-like system, it should work fine, if not you'll possibly need to change the paths). It also contains a file (pp.conf) that lists all my podcasts. You should tweak them unless your tastes match mine. If you use bashpodder, you can copy the bp.conf (rename it pp.conf) and podcast.log straight over and it'll work with them.
The Perl script requires XML::Simple which will be in your Linux distro most likely. If not, it's in CPAN (if you're using Perl on Windows, I'm sure you can work it out :) In Debian, just
apt-get install libxml-simple-perl
It also uses LWP, which may or may not be in the base Perl install, I can't remember.
Any questions, comments, bugs, whatever, send them my way.
The next step is to move the functionality of the Perl script into NDBM itself, but that will take a lot longer as I want to do it properly and make it look pretty and be usable. |
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Eythian
Posting is for Closers
51 Posts |
Posted - 07/07/2005 : 03:15:54 AM
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For the interested, here is a screenshot of what I've got into NDBM so far regarding podcast support.
http://www.kallisti.net.nz/~robin/ndbm_pod1.png
There are still a few GUI tweaks needed (there is annoying bug you can't see in the screenshot that I'm trying to figure out), and significant parts of the backend stuff still to do (like the actual downloading). It also currently only supports RSS2.0, I guess I'll need to get support for 1.0 in there too, but I'll look into that once everything else is mostly working.
Going to put a few more hours of work into it tonight, and it should be almost completely functional by then I hope.
Any comments of things you think should be there are welcome, now is the best time to add them. |
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guttrhead(at)gmail.com
Posting Mania
399 Posts |
Posted - 07/07/2005 : 08:22:34 AM
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| Very cool. Thanks for all the work you've put into this. I've been waiting for podcast support. I havn't got a chance to play with it yet and won't for a few more days, but it sounds good. Maybe I'll wait till you get everything tweaked right. Thanks again. |
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Eythian
Posting is for Closers
51 Posts |
Posted - 07/07/2005 : 08:35:30 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by guttrhead(at)gmail.com
Very cool. Thanks for all the work you've put into this. I've been waiting for podcast support. I havn't got a chance to play with it yet and won't for a few more days, but it sounds good. Maybe I'll wait till you get everything tweaked right. Thanks again.
Yeah, wait a little. I've actually made more progress than I expected tonight. I'm currently working on the downloading code itself (which is the last major thing in the basic functionality to go). If things keep going as nicely as they have been, I may be in need of a beta tester or two in a couple of hours :)
I found and fixed all the GUI bugs I know of, and so really it's just finishing off the last of the functionality (with the caveat that I haven't extensively tested it at all yet). After that I'll need to make it work from the command line (so you can download updated tracks without having the player plugged in, and when you next run NDBM and hit 'sync' they're all transferred over), but that can wait for another day (and won't be hard at all). Oh, and adding support for formats other than RSS2.0. |
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Eythian
Posting is for Closers
51 Posts |
Posted - 07/07/2005 : 10:51:01 AM
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OK, I'm going to watch stuff and then go off to sleep, so I thought I'd post what I've got for people to try out.
The current version of NDBM with podcast support is at:
http://www.kallisti.net.nz/~robin/NeurosDBM-1.49_pod-0.01alpha.jar
(again, if it asks you to update, don't! I forgot to change the code for that)
the source is at:
http://www.kallisti.net.nz/~robin/ndbm-1.49_pod-0.01alpha.tar.gz
This version is all self-contained, and looks pretty much like the screenshot above. But now it works! (but it may eat your cat, destroy your world, or lose your socks. I haven't tested it much, but it shouldn't do anything bad)
To use it, run it like normal, and click the 'PC' icon (anyone with art skills, make me a better icon! :) Add the feeds you want, and just play around with it. If you have a whole podcast feed selected and hit 'download now' it will download all undownloaded files for that feed. If you select a specific item, it will download that (regardless of it having already been downloaded). Downloaded files go in to ~/.ndbm/podcasts (or the windows equivalent).
Known issues that will hopefully/probably get fixed (yeah, there's a lot, but they're all minor, and it's alpha! This is pretty much my todo list for when I next hack on it):
- When you add a feed, it will sit and not say anything while it loads it. Not bad on a fast connection, but annoying if you're not.
- Ditto updating.
- It currently doesn't autoupdate the feeds. You'll have to manually click 'update feed' to see anything new.
- It can take a while for the downloading progress box to come up. The way the Java progress meter thing works is a bit dumb (or, rather, too smart for it's own good), and I haven't figured out how to tell it not to delay yet.
- If you close the podcast manager window when downloads are going, I think the download window goes away, but the download will keep going. I may have fixed that, but I think I forgot to test the fix.
- If you say to download one thing, and then another thing, they both go at the same time. They probably should get queued and go one at a time.
- Downloading chews stupid amounts of CPU. I know how to deal with the worst of that, but haven't yet.
- If you add a feed, and don't want to download all of it, you have to go to each one and tick 'do not download'. That sucks. Need to add a 'mark all as don't download' option somewhere.
- There's no way to download when not connected to the device. I'll write a standalone program that works with this sometime this weekend I hope.
- There's no way to say 'download everything not already downloaded'. Yet.
- Podcasts will just keep piling up in the download directory (which is currently not configurable). I'll have to think about the best way to deal with that.
- The list of items for a feed will never shrink. It will only grow. I'm thinking I'll add a 'show not downloaded/show all' toggle somewhere, and also have old entries expire (maybe).
Most of these are just little niggles, nothing that can't be fixed with a bit more time. However, as far as my small tests went, the core functionality is there and working.
I'd appreciate it if people could have a play and let me know what works, what doesn't, and what should be changed. In particular tell me any strange GUI things (like states not sticking, things not enabling/disabling when they should, whatever), and also any RSS feed that it spits an error on reading. I haven't tried it on any kind of range yet, so I only know that it works on about 3 that I tried.
Any comments, bugs, suggestions, questions...ask/tell me. I've tried to make it as simple to use as can be, but my definition of simple may differ from yours :) |
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Eythian
Posting is for Closers
51 Posts |
Posted - 07/10/2005 : 10:57:19 AM
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New version out:
http://www.kallisti.net.nz/~robin/NeurosDBM-1.49_pod-0.02alpha.jar
and source:
http://www.kallisti.net.nz/~robin/ndbm-1.49_pod-0.02alpha.tar.gz
This one should be complete enough to be quite usable. Still not perfect, but the more annoying issues have been resolved. In particular there is an 'All Podcasts' entry at the top of the list, and anything that is performed on that (update, download) will happen to all of the podcasts below it. This means you don't have to manually check each feed to see if there is anything new.
Also useful is that you can now set the downloaded state on individual feeds, or all feeds. Click on the highest level you want to change (i.e. a feed, or 'All Podcasts'), select the new state, and hit the 'Set All' button. This works it's way down the tree from the selected point and changes anything below (below in a tree sense, not a list sense...play with it, you'll see)
I still haven't done the standalone part, will get onto that now that the management interface is sufficiently functional. Some time this week I should expect.
Oh, one thing: anything podcast-related you'd set up in the older version will go away when you run this one. I'll try to reduce the chance of that happening as much as I can in the future, but it's sometimes necessary when the internal structure of things changes.
Umm. I think that's it. I can't be bothered listing what's wrong with it this time. Some of the things above still remain, some don't. It should also be able to load some slightly non-standard feeds now, I made the parsing a bit more robust as there were a handful that wouldn't load in it previously.
Comments below! |
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Eythian
Posting is for Closers
51 Posts |
Posted - 07/14/2005 : 10:37:41 AM
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New version, this one with the 'beta' tag as it's feature complete with what I aimed for initially, and has no real bugs that I know about.
Jar: http://www.kallisti.net.nz/~robin/NeurosDBM-1.49_pod-0.03beta.jar
Source: http://www.kallisti.net.nz/~robin/ndbm-1.49_pod-0.03beta.tar.gz
(and yet again I forgot to fix the autoupdate thing, so don't autoupdate)
The main thing added in this is a podcast downloader that doesn't require the Neuros to be plugged in. Just run it with the command line option '-o' (for pOdcast...-p and -c were already taken:)
eg:
java -jar NeurosDBM-1.49_pod-0.03beta.jar -o
So this can be scheduled to run automatically, or whatever, and when you next fire up NDBM anything downloaded will be queued up for addition.
This will probably be the last significant release for a while, there's things I want to add to it, but now it does everything of importance I wanted from it and is hopefully useful to you guys too. Any bugs found will probably hasten an update however, I expect there are some.
Go nuts! |
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Eythian
Posting is for Closers
51 Posts |
Posted - 07/26/2005 : 08:45:56 AM
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More updates:
Jar file: http://www.kallisti.net.nz/~robin/NeurosDBM-1.49_pod-0.04.jar
Source: http://www.kallisti.net.nz/~robin/ndbm-1.49_pod-0.04.tar.gz
Changes (well, most of them):
* files are added to the playlist in reverse order (which means the correct order, oldest to newest)
* more date handling improvements...it seems some RSS authors can't stick to standards, this version deals with all the varieties I've seen, and I hope to write a generic date handler some time. (The guts is: more feeds will work)
* the command line downloading output is a bit more informative.
* a few bug fixes and miscellaneous things.
BTW, I've tried to get in touch with the original NDBM devs about getting CVS commit access, currently to no avail :(
I've dropped the beta tag, because as far as I can tell it does all the important things I want it to. There are things that will be added, and I'll post them here as I do them, but they're not really essential (except for the desire to clean out the podcast directory when things get old, that's probably the highest priority)
Let me know any suggestions, and especially:
* features you want
* bugs you've found
* feeds that don't work
Hell, tell me if you're using it, so I know what sort of priority I should give to releasing updates. |
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Pierre LaStank
Posting is for Closers
63 Posts |
Posted - 07/26/2005 : 11:22:03 AM
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Eythian, thank you so much for your continued work. It's nice to see that there are those with the ability that are interested in not only maintaining the current feature set, but adding to it. Excellent.
The podcast support is a great idea. I have only recently (like the past 2 weeks) begun to listen to them and have found that I am getting hooked. My ability to play them using my Neuros has been somewhat limited by my laziness (all that cutting and pasting sure does break a sweat, no?) so seeing that there is someone around looking to make it a bit more seemless is fantastic.
At this time I have a Mac running 10.4.2 and a windows Xp machine. As of now I use the Mac to rip with iTunes, transfer over to the Neuros and synch with Sorune on the XP machine. A bit of a PITA so I was excited to see the NDBM support for podcasts. Viola, all in one solution. Except that NDBM does not seem to want to read the iTunes tags. Whether this is an issue with iTunes or if it's an issue with NDBM, I do not know, nor do I have the skills to look into it myself. I saw in another thread that someone else was having this same issue. Is there any progress on this front? I certainly don't mean that to dump it into your lap, I'm just curious. |
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Eythian
Posting is for Closers
51 Posts |
Posted - 07/26/2005 : 11:36:14 AM
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quote:
The podcast support is a great idea. I have only recently (like the past 2 weeks) begun to listen to them and have found that I am getting hooked.
They are dangerously addictive, aren't they? :) I'm mostly stymied by the fact that it's a 15 min walk to uni for me, and so I don't get through much in that time. I guess I should start walking more :)
quote:
At this time I have a Mac running 10.4.2 and a windows Xp machine. As of now I use the Mac to rip with iTunes, transfer over to the Neuros and synch with Sorune on the XP machine. A bit of a PITA so I was excited to see the NDBM support for podcasts. Viola, all in one solution.
Eep, that is sure a tedious sounding procedure. You should be able to run Sorune on the Mac however (I'm not sure, I've never really used it). In fact, NDBM will run on the Mac fine too (in fact, probably better, I think OSX is smarter than windows when it comes to Java)
quote:
Except that NDBM does not seem to want to read the iTunes tags. Whether this is an issue with iTunes or if it's an issue with NDBM, I do not know, nor do I have the skills to look into it myself. I saw in another thread that someone else was having this same issue. Is there any progress on this front? I certainly don't mean that to dump it into your lap, I'm just curious.
Ah, that's right. There is something funny about either the way iTunes writes the IDv3 tags, or the way NDBM reads them (or both, although I'm suspecting the latter a bit more). I've not done any real work on that, but I have been talking to some people who have done related stuff to get their input. Anyway, all going well I'll hopefully spend some time looking into it on my evenings through the rest of the week. I'll post if I come up with something. |
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Pierre LaStank
Posting is for Closers
63 Posts |
Posted - 07/26/2005 : 6:05:22 PM
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It is a tedious procedure indeed. Exactly why I was looking for a better solution. I have not been able to get Sorune to run on the Mac (and do not see where on the Sorune site there is mention of it being able to do so) and NDBM has the 'issues' that I have already mentioned. My PC is a laptop with a 40gb HDD which is too small to store my collection, I like to keep the laptop mobile so I would not look to use an external drive so that leaves my Mac as the place to rip and store my music. Up until this point, my solution of transferring from Mac and synching with PC has been fine as it would only be when I buy new music (not as often any more) that I would need to do this. Now that I have become interested in listening to podcasts, my synching needs have changed and the 'little inconvenience' has become far more annoying.
I know that when I sync iTunes songs using Sorune, I get a message at the bottom saying that those tracks are problematic in some way (I forget if it actually says that they are incompatible) and that they skip. When I play those tracks on the Neuros, they are fine. All tag information shows up correctly and the music is fine. Odd that.
With NDBM it is far more of an inconvenience. It generally takes all Greatest Hits albums and places them into a various artist folder and mixes the tracks together into one album. That in addition to the issue with only being able to play tracks ripped with iTunes by going into the file browser keeps me from being able to use it effectively. This is also true of Podcasts downloaded through iTunes, though this may be because I actually change the tags of the podcast so that all are listed with the artist being 'podcast' and the album being whomever is the actual podcaster using iTunes.
I am not all that technically savvy (I'm a social worker fer crying out loud) but if I can be of any assistance, let me know (either in the forum or through email). I am new to the Mac world having bought my first one this past Spring, but I have been playing around a fair bit so I might be able to answer some basic questions if you are not familiar with the OS. |
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Eythian
Posting is for Closers
51 Posts |
Posted - 07/26/2005 : 8:33:30 PM
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quote:
I know that when I sync iTunes songs using Sorune, I get a message at the bottom saying that those tracks are problematic in some way (I forget if it actually says that they are incompatible) and that they skip. When I play those tracks on the Neuros, they are fine. All tag information shows up correctly and the music is fine. Odd that.
Hmm. Could you please send me one of those tracks so I have something to test against? (robin at kallisti dot net dot nz) Also, if you could tell me what the message from Sorune actually is, it may be relevant.
quote:
With NDBM it is far more of an inconvenience. It generally takes all Greatest Hits albums and places them into a various artist folder and mixes the tracks together into one album. That in addition to the issue with only being able to play tracks ripped with iTunes by going into the file browser keeps me from being able to use it effectively.
Is it losing the album tag totally? Does it show up when browsing by album, rather than artist?
quote:
This is also true of Podcasts downloaded through iTunes, though this may be because I actually change the tags of the podcast so that all are listed with the artist being 'podcast' and the album being whomever is the actual podcaster using iTunes.
It most probably is. NDBM picks up the correct tags of most (about 2/3rds) of the podcasts I download. They way I handle that is by putting them all into a 'podcast' playlist, that way it doesn't matter too much what the name is, anyway. My modified NDBM will handle sorting them into playlists for you (in fact, there's no way to have it not do that). You just tell it where you want each feed to go (in my case, the default, they all get thrown into 'Podcasts')
quote:
I am not all that technically savvy (I'm a social worker fer crying out loud) but if I can be of any assistance, let me know (either in the forum or through email). I am new to the Mac world having bought my first one this past Spring, but I have been playing around a fair bit so I might be able to answer some basic questions if you are not familiar with the OS.
Thanks :) I do know the Mac platform, not too well but well enough. I don't however actually have access to one, so the biggest thing will probably be testing when I need to try things out. However, I'm working in pure Java, so what works on my Linux box should work just the same on the Mac. In the short term, I probably just need an iTunes modified file that NDBM doesn't pick up the tag for, and I'll try to make it do so. |
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Eythian
Posting is for Closers
51 Posts |
Posted - 07/27/2005 : 07:24:26 AM
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OK, here is a maybe-fixed version that seems to be able to pick up iTunes written tags. I'm still not sure what's going on, but I think it's the case that iTunes isn't following standards correctly, or is using an old one, or something. I'd like to say to everyone not to use it, but I don't think enough people listen to me :)
Anyway, I've forced on a second MP3 parser that was in there, but disabled by default. It seems to work, but I haven't tested it much at all. I found a bunch of libraries to do this kind of thing, and the one that was being used seemed to be really old, so some time I'll go through and test them against each other and put the best one in.
jar file: http://www.kallisti.net.nz/~robin/NeurosDBM-1.49_pod-0.05.jar
src: http://www.kallisti.net.nz/~robin/ndbm-1.49_pod-0.05.tar.gz
There may be problems with this, I don't know. If there are, let me know. Consider this release experimental, but please test it out. |
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Pierre LaStank
Posting is for Closers
63 Posts |
Posted - 07/27/2005 : 08:57:28 AM
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I will check the new version out when I get home from work tonight. I look forward to it. I will also send off a file to you hopefully today (if I can find a cable to pull one off of the Neuros at work).
As for what the message from Sorune actually is, I checked it last night. Basically it says " 'File name' is unsupported, skipping." The tracks do not skip though, nor are they AAC files (iTunes default).
With regard to the questions about the 'Greatest Hits' albums, I am not sure if/how they show up when browsing in any other way besides album/artist. And as I am currently synching with Sorune, I can not just check. I will look into that when I try out your new version. It does not seem to get rid of the tag, as when the track is played, the screen reads correctly. Just when browsing by album/artist does it appear messed up. For example, when I first go into the Album/Artist menu, the first 'Artist' listed is Various Artists with the album listed as 'Greatest Hits' Oddly enough I actually have a various artist listed as an artist but it does not seem to include those albums here. My explanation of this is not so clear so I think I'll stop right here... If you want further clarification I'll try 
Thank you again. |
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Eythian
Posting is for Closers
51 Posts |
Posted - 07/30/2005 : 10:31:41 AM
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Updated version.
Jar file: http://www.kallisti.net.nz/~robin/NeurosDBM-1.49_pod-0.06.jar
Source: http://www.kallisti.net.nz/~robin/ndbm-1.49_pod-0.06.tar.gz
the changes in this one are:
- Built for Java 1.4 so people with older Java environments (esp OSX users) can run it without trouble. If you'd found that NDBM simply wouldn't start, give this one a go.
- Updated the tag reading system, in a less hacky way than the previous release. This means that virtually all files should get the tags (title, artist, album, etc) read correctly. An unfortunate side effect is that adding files is now a bit slower, as the new tag library isn't quite as fast as the old one.
Thanks to 'Pierre' for helping test this one.
Oh, also the autoupdating won't be a problem any more. I finally got around to fixing that (actually a couple of releases ago, but I forgot to mention it) |
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Sean Starkey
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847 Posts |
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arcdx
Posting is for Closers
32 Posts |
Posted - 08/01/2005 : 6:19:19 PM
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Hey guys, thanks a lot of the updates. I'm using it to listen to a podcast right now and it's working great. I am, however, having trouble parsing the podcasts from KCRW, like for example http://kcrw.com/podcast/show/ls
iTunes and SlimServer both seem to parse it okay, but NDBM is having trouble with it. If you have time to take a look, I'd really appreciate it.
Thanks again,
-Steve |
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Eythian
Posting is for Closers
51 Posts |
Posted - 08/01/2005 : 8:44:11 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by arcdx
Hey guys, thanks a lot of the updates. I'm using it to listen to a podcast right now and it's working great. I am, however, having trouble parsing the podcasts from KCRW, like for example http://kcrw.com/podcast/show/ls
Cheers for the feedback, I'll take a look at that one later this evening and fix it up.
BTW, for anyone interested, all the changes I've made are now in the NDBM CVS tree. |
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Eythian
Posting is for Closers
51 Posts |
Posted - 08/02/2005 : 06:19:31 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by arcdx
Hey guys, thanks a lot of the updates. I'm using it to listen to a podcast right now and it's working great. I am, however, having trouble parsing the podcasts from KCRW, like for example http://kcrw.com/podcast/show/ls
OK, fixed. Download:
http://www.kallisti.net.nz/~robin/NeurosDBM-1.49_pod-0.07.jar
Turns out that feed has description tags with no content, which was making my feed reader choke. The things people do...:) |
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arcdx
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32 Posts |
Posted - 08/02/2005 : 07:10:36 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Eythian
OK, fixed. Download:
http://www.kallisti.net.nz/~robin/NeurosDBM-1.49_pod-0.07.jar
Turns out that feed has description tags with no content, which was making my feed reader choke. The things people do...:)
Hrm. I'm still getting a "Sorry, the feed could not be loaded" error for the KCRW one. I should mention that this is on WinXP using ActivePerl as my perl runtime. Is there maybe some verbose debugging I could turn on and get you a more helpful error message?
Thanks a bunch again for the update. I'm really happy to have this feature and I know I'll use it all the time.
-Steve |
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Podcast support in NDBM
